Author: SpeedKills

Posted: Sat Jan 21, 2012 6:59 pm

What I’m really worried about is that as soon as I stop the L Tyrisone, I’ll be inundated with depression. And that’s the worst enemy of anyone who wants to recover from substance abuse :p. But I’ll give it a shot.

Author: amber4.14.11

Posted: Thu Jan 19, 2012 10:01 pm

I just wrote an email to my therapist, having to reschedule my ‘evalution’ that was sopposed to happen tommorow.
see,
the dude, who Im basically taking his job over,,,, hasnt showed up all week, becuase
‘he hurt his back

WE ALL know what this means……lol
anyways, its put the company REALLY BEHIND schedule on the condo project. I even have to work saturday, which is fine becuase I want the overtime. BUT the general contractor wanted to put carpet in the rooms, starting TODAY that Im currently working on…..
So my boss begged me to reschedule my appointment. this is the first time, in all the appointments Ive had for the doctor, therapist, my kid, etc thats he’s ever said he really needed me to reschedule.
So of course I said I would, which made him really happy.
and I havent gotten ANY of the damn homework done anyway, so it kinda makes sense. but I wont tell the boss that, I’ll make brownie points instead
puts me that much closer to that raise as well
Its nice to not be on the shit list these days, thats for sure!!

One of my good friends, thats on suboxone, and goes to same dr. as me, texted me today wanting to know if he could ‘borrow’ some of mine, cuz he had an appointment today, and needed some to take with him…….
I was really confused by this. I’d like to think of him as a pretty good buddy nowadays. His wife is actually the one who first told me about suboxone to begin with….
long ago, we all used together….we even all lived together,,,, me and my husband, and him and his wife, for about 6 months….although I dont remember much… just the highlites……like the cops searching our place after my buddy pulled a gun on the nieghbor…
ANYWAYS,,,,,I simply told him I only had enough with me for the day, and I dont bring more than that with me to work. since I live almost 45 min from work, he took that as the truth I guess.
I asked why he ran out, and he said he didnt but forgot the meds….wierd
and why didnt he just ask his wife??

so now Im of course worried about him. we have almost the same exact time clean, even though we didnt talk for months becuase niether of us knew the other had gone on subs….
I really hope there was some kind of truth to what he said, but who knows.
and if it was a lie, I hope he maybe sold a couple or something, Im really hoping hes not abusing his subs….

whenever I think of someone screwing up,
I always think
‘another one bites the dust’

I guess time will tell.
hope everyone’s doing awesome

Author: finallyachance

Posted: Thu Jan 19, 2012 10:42 pm

I can deal with constructive criticism. This has been a long two year ordeal for me with alot of ups and downs so please no insults or attacks. Just don’t comment if you have plans of such. Thanking you in advance.

Well I went back and seen the doc today. For all of you that know my story somewhat, I want to tell yall that I am not paranoid and afraid anymore of this clinic, the nurses and/or the doctor like I used to be. Six weeks ago when I went in there to be re-admitted, I was real afraid. I had left the clinic because of these two nurses and a grievance and I left before the doctor had received the result of my P&T. Well anyway the director called me and ask me to come back thank god I hated my new clinic but anyways the doctor wanted to see me about the P&T results so anyways I just broke down and told the director all my fears about being decreased or discharged because I have what they call QT Prolongations (527) which the doctor believes is medicine induced not like real, but apparently it is a risk that doctors don’t like to deal with (liability) Well over the last six weeks I have had 30 milligram increase since I have been back at the new clinic and split dose too.

I have struggled with the fact of being honest and telling the doctor that although I feel like the 30 mgs has improved my stabilizing I am still not there. So I went ahead in with my little diary documenting day to day accounting and showing him the results of what effects I got from the split dose and thirty milligram increase. I stayed positive but got my points in that I have felt improvements but I still have some long nights of withdrawal symptoms and cravings too. We talked about his concerns and we discussed my concerns. He told me each 5 or 10 mg increase he signs off on can and does endanger me with my heart and the longer delay in between my heartbeats could be just one time too many and I could die. Methadone must cause this "medicine induced prolonged qtc’s" in my case as I have no family history of such. Well of course my next question/remark was well wouldn’t any opiate do the same? He said yes of course and so I said well if I am not on methadone, no matter what the reason, I will be on something else DOPE not monitored etc…He then said how old are you I said 48 and he had me tell him about my rehab history…12 step history….suboxone attempts and he ask when and if I had ever any real sobriety I told him a year here and there over 30 years but one time I worked in the field so I stayed clean 3 years. He asks me if I had insurance, I said no. At this point I am getting a bit nervous wondering where he was going with all of this. I still don’t know where he was headed with all that DO ANY OF YOU KNOW WHAT HE WAS GETTING AT? I would be real interested to know but I was too afraid to ask because I didn’t want to know either. I mean he is taking this all in. Even sitting back in his chair closing his eyes in silence and thinking real hard. Opening them up and asking me something else closing them in silence and thinking about it even longer etc…

Well he said he was hearing from me that I pretty much plan on being on methadone for a long time maybe forever and it has been the only effective mode of operandi in my recovery history and although he worries and would like to keep me on the smallest amount of methadone he can but he wants it to be working for me also and I am saying if I don’t get stabilized on methadone I will be right back on the dope in no time etc…etc…etc…

So in the end he is giving me 10 more milligrams this week and 10 more milligrams next week. Then I wait two weeks and do a peak and trough He wants me to continue split dose and even when he does the P&T do the split dose which to me makes no sense because of the strategy they have in place for peak and troughs. So Okay, now here is the weird part I wanted to tell yall about and want you all to tell me what you all think about this, After 2 weeks of being at 210 mgs dose I show up at 5 am take my am split dose of 105 milligrams in front of the nurse (which works out great because that’s Thursday my normal clinic day anyway). Wait 15 minutes then I leave and come back at 9am and HE WILL DRAW MY BLOOD HIMSELF IN MY FEMORAL ARTERY. I have had a pic line put in my neck many times but never a femoral vein IS THIS GOING TO HURT???? If you remember I am a terrible stick and they tried three times to do peak and troughs on me for over a year so I could get an increase and but they never were able to get blood. Finally they got one with 12 sticks 6 for the Peak and 6 for the Trough. He said he was not going to put me through that again and he is not so sure why or what he is aiming for by doing a P&T but to have a record documented that they are doing their part to provide me adequate relief but because of the liability and my choice to exercise informed consent. He feels it is necessary. He wants it all there in the chart. He more of less admitted he was going to cover his ass and the clinics ass. He was very nice about saying that though. Plus I will sign all my EKG strips showing that I have been informed about the risk involved in qtc’s regardless their informing me of any dangers, I still chose to take increases. Okay so there is the Peak. Then the next Thursday I am to come in at 7 am and he will draw the trough in my femoral artery before I dose. He called it an unorthodox way to do peak and troughs but he will figure the math out about it being a split dose etc… But what about the three days of taking your meds at exactly the same time in front of staff/nurses and the 30 minute window to get these levels drawn in for any accuracy?? Are those procedures put in place for a good reason so as to get some accurate result or do they implement all that hubbub of dosing in front of staff and being so strategic about dosing at exact time three days in a row etc just so we don’t do things to try to deviate the results? Will my results not be a little compromised by not doing it the regimented way? He told me not to worry myself about any of it because it really will make no changes in increases and/or dose regardless of the numbers he comes up with he just has to have the results to show their attempts to follow procedures. He said he will continue with increases if I need regardless the numbers as he believes in the patients’ complaints and his physical evaluations more than any P&T results. Not so sure who he has to answer to etc…but if it’s not going to make any difference why do it at all especially since I am such a hard stick and he has to go with a femoral artery etc…. He validated me that today from just a physical exam he can see the withdrawal symptoms enough that he is convinced I am not stabilized. He told me then to lie down on the exam bed and he looked at my groin and said he didn’t think it would be any problem at all to do the blood work. Anytime they ever did the neck or femoral artery with me in hospital settings, the doctor had to do it so I understand that part, but they also put me in or under twilight. So is that anything for me to worry about??? IS IT GOING TO BE PAINFUL?????? I was too afraid/embarrassed to ask him like a BIG WHIMP. AND….DOES ALL THIS SOUND COPESETIC TO YOU GUYS?

I left the office today feeling good about everything. He was very nice and even sympathetic. He was seriously studying on his thoughts with my case this morning like I said shutting his eyes, thinking hard, talking it all out with me and the director and my counselor. When I got ready to leave he walked me out shook my hand and said don’t worry be patient but we will get you stabilized. He apologized that I have been struggling with this but commended me for not giving up and/or using. OF COURSE DUE TO A LOT OF WHAT ALL YALL SAY I CANNOT HELP BUT WONDER IF HE IS JUST HUMORING ME OR PLACATING ME FOR SOME REASON. The clinic is not my friend. The staff at my clinic will never be my friend etc… So I am wondering what you all think about: The way he is proceeding with my dose/increases? The way he is trying to help me in a sense but admits to covering their butts with excessive documentation (what he said to the director today)? Peak and Trough is such an unorthodox manner, (no three days consistent dose with my entire dose and not only half due to split dose)? The Femoral Artery route? I would really appreciate any thoughts or ideas you all might have.

OH YEAH YALL ONE OTHER THING I AM HAVING THIRTEEN TEETH PULLED ON MY UPPER MOUTH MONDAY. WILL I HAVE ANY PROBLEM GETTING NUMB DIE TO METHADONE? AND IF ANYTHING GOES WRONG LIKE DRY POCKET/SOCKET IS THERE ANYTHING I CAN DO SINCE MY DOSE IS SO HIGH ON METHADONE I WILL JUST HAVE TO LIVE WITH THE PAIN MORE THAN LIKELY HUH?

Author: jonathanm1978

Posted: Fri Jan 20, 2012 7:50 am

My wife can better attest to how hard it is for a non-addict to be with someone who’s been down ‘that road’…it’s definitely a struggle. She’s stuck beside me through some VERY trying times, but hasn’t been easy on her, that’s for sure. It really tested the strength of our love and relationship…especially when I fell off the deep end.

Author: hatmaker510

Posted: Fri Jan 20, 2012 8:03 am

Rule – thanks so much for the update. I’ve been thinking about you a lot. You didn’t mention it, but I assume the surgery was a success in that they got all the cancer?

Like everyone else, I’m stunned that your mother-fucking doctor thinks what he gave you is sufficient to address you pain after that kind of super painful surgery. You know, if what you’re taking isn’t sufficient to keep you out of withdrawals or enough to address your pain, you CAN add a small amount of bupe to your full agonist pain meds. But it sounds like you have enough for treat your pain. If I were you I wouldn’t worry too much about how much you’re taking. I say this because what they did to you and the pain you’re likely in DESERVES ADEQUATE PAIN RELIEF. PERIOD. ENOUGH SAID.

It’s obvious that you’re being careful about what you’re taking and keeping an eye on it so it doesn’t get out of control, but otherwise, just please address your pain. I cannot imagine what you’re going through right now. Hell, I can’t even imagine how you’re sitting at a computer typing this!

Take care and we’re all here for you.

Author: hatmaker510

Posted: Fri Jan 20, 2012 8:11 am

With regard to the vomiting, you have a couple of options. You can swish your mouth out with mouthwash before taking your sub. That will help with absorption and it might taste strong enough to help with the taste. The second option, and this might be better (and it was recommended by Dr. Junig), is to put a breath mint in your mouth ALONG with the suboxone. It will NOT affect the the absorption of the suboxone and it should address the bad taste.

Also, do NOT eat or drink anything for 10-15 minutes after the pill/strip has dissolved. There will still be medication in your mouth that will still be absorbing.

Give these a try and see if they help. Like Bboy said, you may as well give sub the old college try with suboxone before you get to switch back to methadone. You’re on it already – may as well see if it will work for you instead of switching before giving it a chance to work.

Good luck and let us know how it works.

Author: hatmaker510

Posted: Fri Jan 20, 2012 8:14 am

Chained – I don’t know how it happened, but somehow your post got stuck in forum cyber space and didn’t get any replies! Forgive us for that – it sometimes happens.

I want to thank you for sharing your story. It sounds like suboxone was a good treatment option for you. I agree that people need it for their own time frame.

I hope you’ll see this and return to the forum. Even though you probably think we suck by now. :[

Author: Breezy_Ann

Posted: Fri Jan 20, 2012 5:54 pm

When is it safe to begin tapering is the million dollar question. I’m not sure if there is really a right answer because this time line varies so greatly for all of us. I’m going to begin my taper very soon but if I run into any problems I have every intention of reassessing my situation. It’s ok to have a plan but I think we have to be open to throwing that plan out the window if it is threatening our recovery. I guess I’m saying when you think your ready then give it a shot, if it’s not going well it is not a failure to remain on sub.

Like Hat said, if you are having symptoms reducing your dose should help. I think Rule gave you some great advice. You can try lowering your dose, if you get to a point the cravings are coming back you can stop or go back up a bit. Then after some time has passed you can try lowering again.

I highly recommend reading thru the stopping sub section. There are a lot of taper threads with a ton of info that would benefit you greatly when your ready to taper. Congrats again on your success and I am glad you found us!

Author: The Captain

Posted: Fri Jan 20, 2012 6:17 pm

Thanks for the replies guys!

I especially appreciate your personal stories…it always helps to hear them.

I know about the issues w/sex and porn issues bc he’s straight up told me and others about it. I’ve had my own trauma issues in the past (i’ve long since dealt w them) and maybe it’s just something in the back of my head giving me the creeps. The doctor has never done anything overtly inappropriate other then the supervised ua itself. I’d also like to say I’ve never cheated a UA, I’ve always followed the rules to the letter. But even with the supervised UA’s, I know proof positive there are patients that still cheat.

Mostly I was wondering if this was unique, do your doctors supervise you?

I guess I don’t really agree with the love it or leave it approach. I feel the doctor and patient relationship is a mutual one. Just because the doctor writes suboxone doesn’t mean we should hold them to different standard then what we’d expect in any other medical care situation. I think the doctor should be open and willing to listen. Don’t know about you guys, but I’ve seen more than one sleezy suboxone doctor unfortunately. Completely disconnected and and aloof… obviously in it for the money. Not that that’s a bad thing necessarily, they should just remember that it is us the patients paying for this service and w/out us..there would be no money. I know some bupe patients are anxious for ever single office visit, and feel the need to conceal somethings about how they’re feeling for fear of judgement. A lot of us don’t demand adequate care bc we feel we don’t deserve it after years of unworthy self-feelings …

I’ve come to learn that physical dependence and drug addiction are different. Most people don’t agree though.

Ultimately medical care is in our own hands. Gotta remind myself that sometime…

Thanks again for your replies guys, I certainly appreciate them.

Author: Jimmy

Posted: Fri Jan 20, 2012 7:22 pm

I’ve never craved NO2 after a dentist appointment, but I’m not suggesting it doesn’t happen. Every now and then I come across an article about some dentist who is addicted to it. It does act on opiate receptors.

I would think suboxone would block it’s effects, but apparently not! Very interesting. Maybe if they figure out why sub doesn’t block it, it would lead to some very important discoveries about opiate receptors!

It is used in some parts of the world to treat alcohol and other addictions (NO2 in South Africa). Humans react very differently to it, as do various other species. It causes dopamine release, but blocks the dopamine release of amphetamines. Very interesting reading! Wiki page for NO2